Safe Survival Plans for 1.18! (Reset Planned)

Discussion in 'News & Announcements' started by Shazepe, Jan 8, 2022.

  1. doubex1

    doubex1 Moderator Moderator

    I have one question just because it popped into my head as I was reading it. Yes I have read the entire post and understand your view on the matter. I should say my question has nothing to do with the staff team's overall "plan"(air quotes), its purely for my ideas and opinions. :

    Would you be okay with keeping your vote total and being able to build on it, as well as getting some sort of achievement item. BUT, you would restart your visible rank at Steve and continue to rank up thereafter, and you have the option to display your highest achieved rank.

    Now that being said from a mod perspective I'm not sure this can be done with the vote plugin but never say never.
     
  2. I forgot about vote points xD
     
  3. Why not sale prime locations around spawn? draw up a grid, leaving room for a N/S/E/W Broadway Path, The more "PRIME" the location the higher the cost, Bid. If a 3000+ Votes Fossil wants a connected 4 lot site, buy it. Rewards for years of faithful Play on SS. Save a quad for the future even. Between X and Y distance from the center of Spawn, $$ per lot. Want a bigger lot, bid on more, too expensive, bid on a lot further out in a cheaper zone. We've got time, Rewards loyalty, Save a quad for any that want the land rush thrill, And If allowed I'd put in the time need to make it happen, and then give back to staff for final approval before posting. And beings I had to change toons to give my son his back, my vote count is next to nothing, so I get zero out of this. It's not for me, it's for all those that have put years into helping this server stay one of the best and at the top of the list.
     
  4. Eugene H. Krabs

    Eugene H. Krabs Moderator Moderator

    After much thinking and talking with other people to see a different perspective. I have two new lines of thinking.

    The first is waiting to regive people their items for a couple months or maybe until all warps have been released. This allows everyone to get their items back, but allows the launch of the map to be more fair, nobody running past everyone else at warps and claiming everything.

    The next idea could even be lumped in with the my first or be independent and that would be a prestige system. If vote ranks aren't rolled over, everyone's previous ranks is remembered. For example let's say you're highest rank was Millionaire before the reset. Until Master rank, you would get prestige ranks like Steve2, Recruit2 and so on until you hit Millionaire2 and then after that you would default to the ranks as they are now on the new map. As a consolation prize, each rank could have unique item (nothing OP, think fools gold from the April Billy or an offhand that's not meant for speed, or even in line with some like Explorer's Compass) or head as a way of saying thank you for past votes. This idea rewards past votes because it allows people who are collectors like myself a new item to obtain new things. It allows people who are fossil plus to have something to work to again.

    Lastly, like mentioned above personally daily streaks could be reworked. For example, the 5 day streak rewards the same music disc each time. I'm not sure if the vote plugin would allow this, but make the 5 day streak be able to give any one of the discs and set each disc to some different percentage. I'm not sure if even making more vote streak rewards would be helpful at all, but it's another thought
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  5. yall are begging for the staff to do so much. a reset is meant to work as a fresh start with a new update. allowing people to transfer over items and vote ranks essentially makes half of the point of the reset useless
     
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  6. Imagine being high up vote rank and/or fossil and losing all that progress and becoming a Steve again. I mean sure im fine with losing the rewards but the ranks should stay or at least give us the rewards for our current ranks again as a one time mulligan, it would be easier then giving all the previous vote rewards including the current again. Transferring items is pointless as you said though, its meaningless, point of a reset is a new start, especially since this one is planned.

    As for begging, not everyone is doing that, they are sharing opinions on the matter and feel kinda ambushed by this announcement, which I didn't agree until recently when i thought more on it that it is a bit too soon to announce a reset, but i suppose its better then having it announced with a week later to commence the reset. (and even better then an unexpected unplanned reset)

    I mean they do give people a week to go to their warps, save coords and use world downloader to get their bases saved for single player. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  7. doubex1

    doubex1 Moderator Moderator

    I mean would basically be a two time mulligan since last reset they carried over.

    Personally i'm fine with a full reset of my vote rank and items. I love to start fresh since voting and ranking up again gives me great satisfaction. As well seeing the vote rankups in chat causes more people to vote, as it reminds them a lot more.
     
  8. True this is my first reset so I am fine with re-earning the rewards and vote ranking up again, though im so close to being king xD but alas, starting over is something i may have to possibly accept and i will with a smile.
     
  9. M53

    M53 Recruit

    Thought I’d add my opinion to the decision to either keep or reset the vote ranks for the upcoming map reset.

    I’ll start with a brief introduction as to why I’m even qualified to have an opinion on this matter as I do not particularly partake much in the social aspect of the server as much as some others do. I’ve started playing on this server around 2016 and have been here since (with some minor breaks here and there) building the same things over and over again – but a better variation each time. I current hold a Fossil rank with 2360 votes, and I’d like to think that I am one of the “OG” players here. My most notable build on this server, including on the previous maps, is my overworld highway system: the Trans-Minecraft Highway series. I’ve been banned on this server before for using the x-ray mod to fund all of my builds when I first joined the server and since appealed the ban (all on the server’s old legacy forums). Now I’m still here after 6 years or so, and I fully support keeping the voting ranks with the accompanied rewards.

    First, I hope to keep our current vote ranks with rewards because I strongly believe that the titles and rewards are paramount to maintain older player’s loyalty to the server. There is absolutely nothing stopping older players from leaving the server if ranks and rewards are just simply wiped in the matter of a map reset. Even if we were to just keep the voting titles and not the rewards, this would be more or less meaningless. The way I see it, if one were to be a Fossil rank, and have none of the rewards accompanying this title, then good for you? There is no sense of achievement for the player with this solution and is almost degrading. Anyone could just as easily buy a custom rank with a custom title they desire which would probably even have a “cooler” meaning than having a “Fossil" rank.

    Additionally, keeping the existing voting ranks and rewards encourages others who see people with higher voting ranks, and are currently not that rank, to continue voting. I agree with the others who mentioned to add ranks after Fossil. The rewards after Fossil do not have to be as extreme such as unlimited set homes, but I would continue voting to just be rewarded with additional claim blocks. I even believe that some of the rewards that accompany the higher voting ranks are a bit on the extreme end. Of course, everyone is entitled to there own opinions, but I would be happy enough if the rewards were just exp, diamonds, claim blocks, and a new title name with a different color scheme. Personally, the only vote rewards that were of any use to me were just the previously listed items and the Walking Stick. I could have done fine without any of the additional clutter. Coming back to my original point, lower voting ranked players can see that the high-level voting ranks are attainable and pushes them to achieve the same goals. I don’t see the problem in adding unlimited voting ranks such as Fossil 1, Fossil 2, Fossil 3, etc. as it keeps increasing the goal and gives the players a sense of purpose to continue voting.

    Moreover, resetting the vote ranks with rewards is not a good plan since this will ultimately hurt the server as opposed to helping it. Simply resetting the voting ranks and rewards is a wishful solution to a much bigger problem. The pros of resetting the vote ranks is to force everyone, old and new players, to vote again to achieve new or previously held vote rewards. In return, this will bring the server’s vote numbers back up to its peak and hopefully the Safe Survival server listing can be at/near the top of semi-vanilla survival servers again. The cons of this top-down approach is that it completely destroys any respect the server has for loyal players and leaves a bitterness to those who has dedicated so much time to the server over the years. As mentioned before, this will only further push older players away from a once thriving server. On the other hand, the goal could be to eradicate the existing player base and replace it with a completely new player base in which this would be a great decision to make: i.e. starting completely new.

    I completely agree with Nekkid in saying that old votes don't help the server at all "in the now", but I just can't see how wiping the vote ranks and rewards help us "in the now." I was joking when I said we should all have to pay $100 to reclaim our voting ranks, but if the server is that desperate, and this is the direction we're going in, we might as well implement it.

    Now for this next part, I want to go over some reasons I believe that are leading to the server’s downfall/"the much bigger issue."

    Lack of “Vanilla” in a Semi-Vanilla Server
    When I first joined the server, the spawn was in a corner in a plains biome with very limited admin structures. Personally, I expect to join a vanilla-looking server when I join a semi-vanilla server. I did not like the big, floating quartz spawn we had last map as that completely destroyed the idea of “vanilla” for me. The fact that there were even teleportation features to connect to buildable real estate surrounding the spawn location was what really put in the nail in the coffin for me for me even thinking that this was a "semi-vanilla" server. Additionally, the admin paths, structures, and shops/traders again hurt the "vanillaness" of this server. Ideally, there are no admin builds at all in a vanilla server, but I get that this is a semi-vanilla server. In my opinion, we are really hitting near that semi-vanilla to not-vanilla boundary. Maybe non-vanilla is what we're going for now. This current spawn is better, but I'm not really sure at this point. I hope server staff really takes a look at the server fundamentals again and reestablishes the purpose of this semi-vanilla server.

    The warps and Unlimited Set Homes.
    The server already does not promote “/tpa” and yet we can set unlimited homes (at a certain rank) or warp thousands of blocks away from spawn. I know a lot of new players join the server and immediately leave once told that the server does not support teleportation capabilities besides their first free moderator-assisted teleport. We try to appease these new players by even implementing this moderator-assisted teleport option, but have we ever stopped to think that this is destroying a core feature in a supposedly semi-vanilla server? Have we ever thought that this server genre is just not right for this new player? I personally would not join a towny server to play a in “semi-vanilla” setting. I certainly would not join a RP Minecraft server to try and play creative mode. Unfortunately, I see this trend happen a lot in a lot of older games I used to play which have gradually died/are dying off (i.e. Combat Arms and the dying the infamous Call of Duty series). These game developers are trying to add features from other games to their game that was not originally designed for, ultimately driving away their existing, older player base. I would hate to see it happen to this server where we add popular features from other servers due to a large request from new players. This ruins the server’s uniqueness and would even lower the server listing score as there would be no reason to join this server instead of the next popular Minecraft survival server.

    The Lack of Map Resets
    Now this last argument hurts my builds the most as my builds never end, so a reset would be extremely detrimental to my progress; however, I would still like to include it as I believe it is another critical cause leading to the server’s downfall. The truth is that all games get boring. I cannot count the number of times I get on and see people stating that they are bored. Games die, maps die, and people quit. When the server first launched this map variation, I believe we were at or near 100 players for the first couple of days or weeks. I remember waiting for someone to leave the server so I could join. The last time this happened was when I first joined the server in 2016. However, the same thing happens, as it always does, people end up building something around Spawn or a warp claim and end up leaving because they get bored and life happens. People get bored and having a map that runs on for years after it was initially launched is not sustainable for this type of server. I have no doubt that the same exact thing is going to happen with this next map reset, so we should only expect a temporarily increase in players and gradually see the player count return to where we are today if nothing else is changed. However, do not confuse this opinion with my map reset opinion: I do encourage a consistent server map reset along with other changes.

    The Game is Dying
    What more is there to say? People get old and grow out of Minecraft and video games in general. The fact that I am 23 and still play Minecraft post college graduation with a career is strange and probably not healthy.

    Last, I want to ask one final question: what is the problem with reclaiming our vote ranks and rewards like we did for our current map?

    My preferred solution, right or wrong, is to just delay the retrieval of our vote ranks and rewards after Spawn and all warps have been released. This keeps it fair for all players to claim whatever they desire in the early stages of the new map. Quite honestly, I do not agree that older players/paying players should have any advantage to claiming land around spawn, warps, or any admin generated areas. So what if someone’s claim is in the way? It is the nature of the game and we got through it in this map, so we will get through it in the next. I would like to think that everyone would just be a good neighbor and work with each other, but of course, being that civilized and actually working together is insanity, right? This problem only arises with the GriefProvention plugin – again another non-vanilla feature in a “semi-vanilla” server. Yes, I know that this plugin is vital for a publicly hosted server where we can't trust each other, but this is just another example of server/admin created obstacles.

    If you have made it this far, thanks for reading! I feel comfortable sharing all of this because I have no intention to return to the server if voting ranks and rewards are reset. Plus, I’m getting old, so there’s really no reason I should continue to play Minecraft in general whether it be on a new server or in a single player world. Throughout my years here, I have witnessed my virtual neighbors come and go, and quite honestly, I just get a sense of emptiness every time I walk my builds. Now I may have been completely out of place for some things I have said for a guy who does not like to say much, and I hope to not be seen as “that guy.” These are just my opinions so please read this with a grain of salt (even though I know that means absolutely nothing since that is the same thing as saying, “I know this sounds mean, but I’m going to say it anyways…”). But what do I know, right?




    P.S.
    What’s the problem with allowing players to just download the whole map? With greater accessibility to gigabyte internet speeds, how much do I need to pay the server to make this happen? Standard mechanical hard drives are cheap nowadays, and M.2 NVMe drives are becoming even cheaper. I can’t imagine the map being larger than a few terabytes at most, but I could be wrong.
     
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  10. doubex1

    doubex1 Moderator Moderator

    Nah its healthy and cool, shows commitment.
     
    • Agree Agree x 4
  11. Ikith

    Ikith Master

    First, staff don't perform the reset or do anything related to it (like moving vote and donation reward information over) that's all Schaum.

    Second, doing stuff like this is kind of part of running a Minecraft server, you have to do resets from time to time, and moving data and information over from the previous reset is part of that process.

    Third, donation rewards are being moved over so that contradicts your "fresh start with no items".

    Fourth, resets have happened in the past on safe, and voting and donation rewards were moved over.

    Fifth, where is the begging?

    This would be like the 5th mulligan considering there were resets before this where votes moved over, unless I'm forgetting a vote count reset...
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2022
    • Agree Agree x 2
  12. in all honestly, there is no begging never seen any, I only seen people a tad bit cross with this announcement. Some are upset due to it being announced early, some are upset because they may lose years worth of voting, and some are upset because well map reset. I'm neither upset at any of these but i am repeating myself again that Announcing the reset is a bit early, but i will live with this and await for the reset, Its really hard to get motivated to build even the simple stuff when knowing a reset is coming at an unknown date. But i still get on because my friends are on there.

    As this is my first reset experience, a mulligan for me is this is my first time. I think Ranks should be kept but current ranks get their current rewards and not the previous that would be the more fair thing to do in my opinion. Donator stuff takes priority and should be transferred over as it always had from the past.

    I mean if people think getting all vote rewards is a bit too OP then perhaps just get current rank rewards again and nothing previously. that's just my food for thought though.


    My biggest concerns though is Spawn and Warp Claiming. There were so many abandoned warp claim areas that could of been claimed but couldn't because they most had a lot of people on trust. which is why I feel like Spawn and Warp Claim Both should be limited per player. Merchants, such as those who run big businesses such as desert warp mall (i.e: Kwix in the nether has plots and something like this could work if someone is willing to be a landlord of that said claim warp, and can have the player evicted if they do not get their establishment and have something running within a time frame, extensions would be requested if that said player runs into RL. Remember this is still a game, no one is obligated to do this, this is just an idea, im sure other people have better ideas then my food for thought ideas here..., and etc should be applicable and reserved under as an admin claim until someone is capable of using it and running it as its INTENDED to be used for, Merchant stuff such as shops, etc. and if of course that person fails to create something there and only took it for themselves then they should lose privilege of that claim until someone and or some people are willing to put effort into taking it over. I can already see this idea in my head where a Warp is a designated city with multiple shop outlets and one large mall, and then random plots for housing and anything further past over 1k blocks or so is fair game for whatever.

    I'm sure this doesn't make sense to a lot, usually i have to explain my thoughts again to get it understood.


    Also perhaps a small warp zone for new players, mini shops where they can get a little help to get started and the gist. this should be at spawn and only available to steves - members. prevent older players from going in to take advantage of this.

    Anyway, i wanted to let a lot of this out now and i did.


    (blame my adhd i tend to run off topics onto another and back onto another lol..)
     
  13. If vote ranks were to reset, we should at least get an item of some kind to show how far we voted. I don't mean item as in an offhand or anything like that, just like a block that has your previous voting rank as the name.

    I agree with this, past votes don't help now but what good would resetting the ranks do for the server? If anything it would stop people from voting because they would think "eh it's all gonna get wiped anyway so what's the point" and that would move the server even further down on server listing sites.

    I also agree with this, it shouldn't be too difficult to zip the world and put it on some sort of file sharing service. The world file should only be a couple hundred gigabytes, up to 1TB. The reason I think this because there's a server (can't say name for obvious reasons) which the world file is over 8TB. This is probably because there would be millions of chunks generated on there and I'm sure a server like this server doesn't have that many chunks. Could be wrong though.
     
  14. tbh i just want the reset
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  15. This is a matter of definition and degree. Long before 1.18 was even released, I have seen multiple players agitating in favor of a full reset, to the point where there were times that I logged off the server because the whole conversation got too upsetting for me. So yes, it may not have been "begging" but there were definitely players vocally in favor of a reset.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
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  16. I can understand that. Its like i said i dont think theres begging but more of the line of people just being agitated, and i cant blame you for going off the server because it upset you, i would too. Im not a fan of conflict and i hope this reset and new map boosts morale.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  17. What about the reset where the backup failed? Didn't we have to start over from Steve? I seem to recall that. Of course though, that wasn't a planned reset..
     
  18. same here, i don't like getting in arguments because i can get a bit... let's say not very nice dw tho hopefully most ppl know im chill like 99% of the time
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  19. Ikith

    Ikith Master

    I stopped voting for Safe ages ago, even before the unexpected reset where there were no backups, and my vote count is 384 that means that the vote count has carried over since the last time I voted.
     
  20. Ikith, the vote counts did not carry over from the most recent reset. The vote ranks did, though, and I recall Shaz saying that he used the vote ranks as indicators for setting everyone's vote counts to "halfway to the next rank".

    In light of which your vote count of 384 doesn't make sense. You really haven't voted at all since before the last reset?
     
    • Agree Agree x 1